WEBVTT 00:00:12.429 --> 00:00:15.682 Oh, here's the guy. 00:00:15.724 --> 00:00:17.475 - Oh, man. 00:01:04.314 --> 00:01:11.321 * * 00:01:40.517 --> 00:01:46.356 - It was probably two weeks into dating Ken 00:01:46.398 --> 00:01:50.026 that he wanted me to go to his cousin's house 00:01:50.068 --> 00:01:53.279 to meet his cousin Angelo. 00:01:53.321 --> 00:01:55.615 Ken had come out here from New York 00:01:55.657 --> 00:01:59.786 and was living with Angelo in Glendale. 00:02:01.246 --> 00:02:03.540 Angelo had an upholstery business. 00:02:03.581 --> 00:02:05.500 He did upholstery on cars. 00:02:05.542 --> 00:02:08.378 And then in front of that was his house. 00:02:10.005 --> 00:02:13.383 Angelo wasn't friendly. 00:02:13.425 --> 00:02:15.135 He was nothing like Ken. 00:02:15.176 --> 00:02:16.886 He was very cold. 00:02:16.928 --> 00:02:19.014 He did not talk very much at all. 00:02:19.055 --> 00:02:20.765 He was in and out of the house 00:02:20.807 --> 00:02:22.600 'cause he was taking care of his business 00:02:22.642 --> 00:02:24.060 out in the upholstery shop. 00:02:24.102 --> 00:02:29.774 But I found him very gruff, very abrupt. 00:02:29.816 --> 00:02:33.862 There was nothing relaxing or peaceful about him. 00:02:33.903 --> 00:02:37.741 He just seemed very mad at the world. 00:02:38.867 --> 00:02:40.535 When I would be at Angelo's house, 00:02:40.577 --> 00:02:42.203 there was a lot of girls there. 00:02:42.245 --> 00:02:45.498 And Angelo would tell me it's his daughter's friends. 00:02:45.540 --> 00:02:50.837 And I didn't see anything wrong 00:02:50.879 --> 00:02:53.506 with the interaction between him and the girls. 00:02:53.548 --> 00:02:58.845 I didn't see any funny business at all. 00:02:58.887 --> 00:03:00.263 Was I blind? 00:03:00.305 --> 00:03:02.307 I don't know. 00:03:03.892 --> 00:03:05.977 - Kenneth Bianchi arrived in court today. 00:03:06.019 --> 00:03:08.229 Bianchi is accused in the strangulation deaths 00:03:08.271 --> 00:03:09.522 of two Bellingham coeds, 00:03:09.564 --> 00:03:11.608 Karen Mandic and Diane Wilder. 00:03:11.649 --> 00:03:14.361 He's also a major suspect in several of the so-called 00:03:14.402 --> 00:03:16.780 Los Angeles Hillside Strangler murders. 00:03:16.821 --> 00:03:19.532 - For the past several weeks, Bianchi has been going 00:03:19.574 --> 00:03:20.992 through a battery of psychological 00:03:21.034 --> 00:03:22.952 and medical tests to determine whether or not 00:03:22.994 --> 00:03:25.914 he is mentally competent to stand trial. 00:03:25.955 --> 00:03:29.751 * * 00:03:29.793 --> 00:03:31.628 - Bianchi got arrested in January. 00:03:31.670 --> 00:03:35.048 So this was probably around, like, maybe March, April. 00:03:35.090 --> 00:03:38.385 Up until then, Bianchi was represented by council. 00:03:38.426 --> 00:03:39.886 He had an attorney. 00:03:39.928 --> 00:03:42.639 And I don't think he'd given any statements 00:03:42.681 --> 00:03:44.599 to the Bellingham guys, 00:03:44.641 --> 00:03:47.143 other than these video tapes trying to establish 00:03:47.185 --> 00:03:48.561 his insanity defense. 00:03:48.603 --> 00:03:52.232 We'd watched a few of these sessions. 00:03:52.273 --> 00:03:53.566 If they taped him on Monday, 00:03:53.608 --> 00:03:55.151 by Wednesday we had the tape of it. 00:03:55.193 --> 00:03:56.403 And we'd sit and look 'em. 00:03:57.779 --> 00:03:58.863 - Big deal, so I killed a couple of *s. 00:03:58.905 --> 00:04:00.907 You keep saying I killed those girls. 00:04:00.949 --> 00:04:02.242 I didn't. 00:04:02.283 --> 00:04:04.828 Strangled them all. It's the easiest way to go. 00:04:04.869 --> 00:04:06.830 - He vacillated backwards and forwards. 00:04:06.871 --> 00:04:09.499 - You know, there's a *' right way to do things, 00:04:09.541 --> 00:04:11.376 and there's *' my way to do things, 00:04:11.418 --> 00:04:13.169 and my way has always been the right way. 00:04:13.211 --> 00:04:14.963 - I mean, it was-- 00:04:15.005 --> 00:04:16.589 it was comical. 00:04:16.631 --> 00:04:19.426 - At the same time, Bianchi had facts 00:04:19.467 --> 00:04:21.386 that only the murderer would know. 00:04:21.428 --> 00:04:22.929 And he knew 'em. 00:04:23.555 --> 00:04:25.306 - I'm gonna go down the line. 00:04:26.099 --> 00:04:28.101 Washington was for prostitution. 00:04:28.143 --> 00:04:29.644 Miller was for prostitution. 00:04:29.686 --> 00:04:32.605 The difference from Miller was that she was blindfolded. 00:04:32.647 --> 00:04:36.776 Kastin, it was for a burglary that had occurred. 00:04:36.818 --> 00:04:39.112 - Nobody else could have known that 00:04:39.154 --> 00:04:40.655 unless they were the suspect. 00:04:40.697 --> 00:04:43.491 And then he connected his cousin, 00:04:43.533 --> 00:04:48.371 Angelo Buono, to the murders. 00:04:48.413 --> 00:04:51.333 - And I thought, that name rings a bell. 00:04:56.379 --> 00:04:58.214 - We'd already heard about this guy, 00:04:58.256 --> 00:04:59.883 Angelo Buono, months ago. 00:05:13.188 --> 00:05:16.483 - Prior to Bellingham Police Department calling us 00:05:16.524 --> 00:05:19.027 in January of '79, 00:05:19.069 --> 00:05:21.279 I'd never heard either of their names. 00:05:21.321 --> 00:05:24.199 Shortly after, Bianchi was arrested in Bellingham. 00:05:24.240 --> 00:05:26.117 Obviously, it hit the press. 00:05:26.159 --> 00:05:28.078 - Bianchi has been solidly linked 00:05:28.119 --> 00:05:30.246 to at least four, probably five, 00:05:30.288 --> 00:05:31.623 of the so-called Los Angeles 00:05:31.665 --> 00:05:33.041 Hillside Stranglings. 00:05:33.083 --> 00:05:34.209 - By that time, 00:05:34.250 --> 00:05:39.047 it was kind of agreed upon by the LAPD guys 00:05:39.089 --> 00:05:41.007 there was at least two suspects, 00:05:41.049 --> 00:05:42.717 as far as positioning of the bodies 00:05:42.759 --> 00:05:44.552 and stuff like that. 00:05:44.594 --> 00:05:46.680 After it came to light that Bianchi was 00:05:46.721 --> 00:05:49.683 one of the strangler suspects, 00:05:49.724 --> 00:05:51.184 it was only a couple of days later 00:05:51.226 --> 00:05:53.436 that we get a phone call. 00:05:53.478 --> 00:05:55.647 An attorney by the name of David Wood. 00:05:55.689 --> 00:05:57.691 And I had known David. 00:05:57.732 --> 00:06:00.485 He was big in defending dope cases. 00:06:00.527 --> 00:06:02.028 He called and said, 00:06:02.070 --> 00:06:04.823 "If Kenneth Bianchi is one of your stranglers, 00:06:04.864 --> 00:06:07.075 "I know who the other one is. 00:06:07.117 --> 00:06:09.119 It's a guy by the name of Angelo Buono." 00:06:10.036 --> 00:06:11.955 So, naturally, we descend on David. 00:06:13.123 --> 00:06:14.499 Tell us all about this. 00:06:16.126 --> 00:06:18.878 * * 00:06:18.920 --> 00:06:21.131 And he tells us prior to any of the murders, 00:06:21.172 --> 00:06:22.716 David had gone through a divorce. 00:06:22.757 --> 00:06:25.802 So he was feeling lonely, 00:06:25.844 --> 00:06:30.765 and he called a number in the "L.A. Free Press" 00:06:30.807 --> 00:06:33.393 advertising, you know, young ladies available 00:06:33.435 --> 00:06:35.437 for lonely men. 00:06:35.478 --> 00:06:38.481 They sent a gal out to him. 00:06:38.523 --> 00:06:40.942 Turned out to be Becky Spears. 00:06:41.735 --> 00:06:43.820 She was very young. She was a runaway. 00:06:43.862 --> 00:06:46.906 Anyhow, they get talking, Becky and David. 00:06:46.948 --> 00:06:50.744 Becky explains that she and another gal, Sabra Hannan, 00:06:50.785 --> 00:06:53.955 are living at Angelo Buono's house. 00:06:54.664 --> 00:06:57.417 They're being pimped out as prostitutes 00:06:57.459 --> 00:06:59.961 by Bianchi and Buono. 00:07:00.003 --> 00:07:02.797 So this is what David is telling us. 00:07:02.839 --> 00:07:04.799 - Okay, I don't know-- I'm not sure 00:07:04.841 --> 00:07:07.385 where Sabra Hannan came from. 00:07:07.427 --> 00:07:09.220 But she-- 00:07:09.262 --> 00:07:13.141 she was working for Angelo and myself. 00:07:14.476 --> 00:07:15.810 What she was doing was-- 00:07:15.852 --> 00:07:17.896 she started out by turning tricks for Angelo 00:07:17.937 --> 00:07:20.273 out of his house from his shop. 00:07:20.315 --> 00:07:23.943 - Bianchi and Buono were trying to set up an escort service. 00:07:23.985 --> 00:07:26.613 * * 00:07:26.655 --> 00:07:28.198 And so they needed girls. 00:07:28.239 --> 00:07:31.701 And they had Sabra come out and stay with them. 00:07:31.743 --> 00:07:34.120 And she had her friend Becky come out. 00:07:34.162 --> 00:07:36.831 And neither one of 'em liked what the arrangement 00:07:36.873 --> 00:07:39.334 was starting to reveal itself to be. 00:07:39.376 --> 00:07:40.919 - It's evolved to the point 00:07:40.960 --> 00:07:43.838 where they're just pimping 'em. 00:07:44.422 --> 00:07:48.968 There'd been a few parties of wealthy gentlemen 00:07:49.010 --> 00:07:51.304 that they'd attended, where they, you know, 00:07:51.346 --> 00:07:55.350 their services were provided by Bianchi and Buono. 00:07:55.392 --> 00:07:59.437 - The parties were held in the summer of 1977 00:07:59.479 --> 00:08:01.022 at a paper plant in Cudahy. 00:08:01.064 --> 00:08:03.191 A source close to the investigation says 00:08:03.233 --> 00:08:04.901 the parties look like a convention 00:08:04.943 --> 00:08:06.611 of public officials. 00:08:07.320 --> 00:08:09.239 - What they did was they had two rooms set up. 00:08:09.280 --> 00:08:13.159 One room was right off of the bar and card room. 00:08:14.494 --> 00:08:15.662 That had a shower and everything. 00:08:15.704 --> 00:08:18.707 And the other room just had a bed. 00:08:18.748 --> 00:08:20.959 That was down the hall a bit. 00:08:21.001 --> 00:08:22.794 And the girls would go there. 00:08:22.836 --> 00:08:25.630 And after sitting around and talking, 00:08:25.672 --> 00:08:26.965 having a couple drinks, 00:08:27.007 --> 00:08:29.217 the guys would take turns. 00:08:31.678 --> 00:08:33.054 - Sabra Hannan and Rebecca were there 00:08:33.096 --> 00:08:35.181 way before the murders started. 00:08:35.223 --> 00:08:38.351 * * 00:08:38.393 --> 00:08:40.687 Eventually they ran away. 00:08:40.729 --> 00:08:43.189 So we had to search and find 'em 00:08:43.231 --> 00:08:44.816 when we interviewed 'em. 00:08:44.858 --> 00:08:46.735 The girls don't know anything-- 00:08:46.776 --> 00:08:49.487 never admitted to knowing anything about the murders 00:08:49.529 --> 00:08:51.531 or seeing any of the victims there. 00:08:51.573 --> 00:08:54.868 So we assumed that that was correct. 00:08:55.869 --> 00:08:59.039 - We get a load of names from them as to people 00:08:59.080 --> 00:09:00.957 that they were being pimped out to. 00:09:00.999 --> 00:09:04.294 Guy that was a chief of police, retired chief of police 00:09:04.336 --> 00:09:05.837 from Huntington Park. 00:09:05.879 --> 00:09:09.674 Was a field deputy with the L.A. County government. 00:09:10.925 --> 00:09:12.886 - Angelo Buono was very involved 00:09:12.927 --> 00:09:14.512 with city officials. 00:09:14.554 --> 00:09:18.224 He liked to play the role of wheeler-dealer, 00:09:18.266 --> 00:09:21.019 and these young women were part of that. 00:09:21.061 --> 00:09:22.270 - I didn't give a crap 00:09:22.312 --> 00:09:24.064 what the city councilmen were doing. 00:09:24.105 --> 00:09:25.565 We could've gone into it, 00:09:25.607 --> 00:09:27.150 but it wouldn't have done us any good 00:09:27.192 --> 00:09:28.401 in convicting Buono. 00:09:28.443 --> 00:09:32.072 The only thing we were concerned in is Buono 00:09:32.113 --> 00:09:34.366 and the Hillside Strangler case. 00:09:36.785 --> 00:09:38.203 - Up to this point, 00:09:38.244 --> 00:09:40.121 the only information we're getting about Buono 00:09:40.163 --> 00:09:42.749 is coming from Sabra and Becky 00:09:42.791 --> 00:09:44.334 and David Wood. 00:09:44.376 --> 00:09:47.921 So LAPD did background check with him. 00:09:47.962 --> 00:09:49.673 And he had a bit of a record. 00:10:01.142 --> 00:10:03.687 - I'd learned that he had this Mafia thing 00:10:03.728 --> 00:10:05.647 and he liked to brag to everybody that he was 00:10:05.689 --> 00:10:07.148 a member of the Mafia, you know. 00:10:07.190 --> 00:10:09.401 And he used that to scare people. 00:10:22.205 --> 00:10:24.082 - Obviously, he's a low-life. 00:10:24.124 --> 00:10:27.961 He was just an undesirable member of society. 00:10:28.003 --> 00:10:30.213 But I guess he was quite successful 00:10:30.255 --> 00:10:31.631 with the ladies. 00:10:31.673 --> 00:10:33.675 He referred to himself as the "Italian Stallion." 00:10:33.717 --> 00:10:34.801 I think he had kids 00:10:34.843 --> 00:10:36.136 by two or three different women. 00:10:38.847 --> 00:10:40.849 - On Colorado Boulevard, 00:10:40.890 --> 00:10:41.975 there were a lot of high school girls 00:10:42.017 --> 00:10:43.935 that would pass by his place. 00:10:43.977 --> 00:10:46.229 And he'd be out in the front yard all the time 00:10:46.271 --> 00:10:49.482 with a six-pack of beer and inviting these girls 00:10:49.524 --> 00:10:52.152 to come have a beer with him, and some of them did. 00:10:52.193 --> 00:10:56.656 - I guess Bianchi was quite the ladies' man, also. 00:10:56.698 --> 00:10:58.450 And with them partnered up, 00:10:58.491 --> 00:11:01.828 it appeared that it was kind of an evolution 00:11:01.870 --> 00:11:03.455 that these guys went through. 00:11:03.496 --> 00:11:06.124 They graduated to getting their own girls 00:11:06.166 --> 00:11:08.376 that they were pimping out. 00:11:08.418 --> 00:11:10.795 Once the information from Bianchi about Angelo 00:11:10.837 --> 00:11:12.047 came to light... 00:11:12.088 --> 00:11:14.716 - They're divided between Angelo and myself. 00:11:14.758 --> 00:11:16.343 - For example, his admissions 00:11:16.384 --> 00:11:18.928 that he and Buono were involved in the killings... 00:11:18.970 --> 00:11:20.430 - Okay, this is-- these are the ones 00:11:20.472 --> 00:11:23.516 that I killed, and these are the ones 00:11:23.558 --> 00:11:25.685 that Angelo killed. 00:11:25.727 --> 00:11:27.479 - I'm thinking, 00:11:27.520 --> 00:11:29.147 so this is the second guy. 00:11:37.447 --> 00:11:39.366 - Well, after we found out about-- 00:11:39.407 --> 00:11:42.827 pretty much all we could about Buono, 00:11:42.869 --> 00:11:45.163 first thing we did was put surveillance on him. 00:11:45.205 --> 00:11:46.873 * * 00:11:46.915 --> 00:11:49.751 We wanted him to know he was being surveyed. 00:11:51.336 --> 00:11:53.004 So there was kind of a game that went on 00:11:53.046 --> 00:11:54.798 between the surveillance guys and Buono. 00:11:54.839 --> 00:11:56.800 They'd give each other the finger in the morning 00:11:56.841 --> 00:11:58.051 when Buono would leave his house. 00:11:59.177 --> 00:12:00.679 - Eventually, it was determined 00:12:00.720 --> 00:12:03.682 that Grogan and I will go interview him, 00:12:03.723 --> 00:12:07.894 just to get him locked into a statement. 00:12:07.936 --> 00:12:10.021 * * 00:12:10.063 --> 00:12:11.981 So Grogan and I go to interview him. 00:12:12.023 --> 00:12:14.109 We interviewed him in the shop. 00:12:14.150 --> 00:12:15.777 And we go in, introduce ourselves, 00:12:15.819 --> 00:12:18.989 talk to him about Bianchi for a bit. 00:12:19.030 --> 00:12:21.700 But he just said, "He lived here with me for a while. 00:12:21.741 --> 00:12:23.243 "He was kind of a pain in the *, 00:12:23.284 --> 00:12:24.494 "so I kicked him out. 00:12:24.536 --> 00:12:26.162 "Whatever he's done and been up to, 00:12:26.204 --> 00:12:28.707 that's his business, got nothing to do with me." 00:12:28.748 --> 00:12:31.042 You know, he was quite cool about it. 00:12:31.084 --> 00:12:34.587 * * 00:12:34.629 --> 00:12:36.881 - We went through all the murders 00:12:36.923 --> 00:12:39.676 with Angelo Buono sitting in his desk. 00:12:39.718 --> 00:12:42.929 And I said, "Okay, do you know this girl?" 00:12:42.971 --> 00:12:44.222 "Never seen her." 00:12:44.264 --> 00:12:45.682 "Do you know this girl?" 00:12:45.724 --> 00:12:48.351 "Oh, I might have seen her on television." 00:12:48.393 --> 00:12:49.769 He was getting a little *y. 00:12:49.811 --> 00:12:51.021 And he goes, "What do you think? 00:12:51.062 --> 00:12:52.439 "You're blaming me with this shit. 00:12:52.480 --> 00:12:55.608 This is my--I didn't do this, my cousin did it." 00:12:57.610 --> 00:12:59.487 - Throughout the interview, it was obvious 00:12:59.529 --> 00:13:01.990 that he wasn't being forthright. 00:13:02.032 --> 00:13:05.118 I believed he was bullshitting us. 00:13:05.160 --> 00:13:08.079 But we didn't have, you know, any substantial facts 00:13:08.121 --> 00:13:10.540 to contradict what he was saying. 00:13:10.582 --> 00:13:12.709 So we just basically let him go. 00:13:13.335 --> 00:13:14.502 I just told him, you know, 00:13:14.544 --> 00:13:15.837 "We think you're bullshitting us, 00:13:15.879 --> 00:13:18.798 but if you are, it'll come to light in the end." 00:13:18.840 --> 00:13:22.677 - So now we have to find other evidence. 00:13:22.719 --> 00:13:25.055 I'm for moving right away on Buono's house. 00:13:25.096 --> 00:13:27.515 And I'm telling everybody in the task force, 00:13:27.557 --> 00:13:29.517 and I'm saying, "We gotta go now. 00:13:29.559 --> 00:13:31.561 "Let's get the search warrant and go. 00:13:31.603 --> 00:13:34.022 "Why are we waiting? The longer we wait, 00:13:34.064 --> 00:13:37.650 the more chance he has to destroy evidence." 00:13:37.692 --> 00:13:40.612 Finally, my chief, Daryl Gates, says, 00:13:40.653 --> 00:13:42.113 "He's right. We're going." 00:13:45.033 --> 00:13:47.994 - Investigators from three law enforcement agencies 00:13:48.036 --> 00:13:50.664 descended on this house and upholstery shop 00:13:50.705 --> 00:13:53.500 at 703 Colorado Street in Glendale this morning 00:13:53.541 --> 00:13:55.585 armed with a search warrant. 00:13:55.627 --> 00:13:59.839 The house and shop are owned by 44-year-old Angelo Buono, 00:13:59.881 --> 00:14:01.716 a cousin of Kenneth Bianchi. 00:14:01.758 --> 00:14:04.469 - We did do a search warrant for his house. 00:14:04.511 --> 00:14:05.804 The house was spotless. 00:14:08.098 --> 00:14:10.517 My first thought was, he's washed all the walls 00:14:10.558 --> 00:14:12.352 with water and vinegar. 00:14:12.394 --> 00:14:13.937 You know, it looked-- 00:14:13.978 --> 00:14:16.856 it didn't have a vinegary smell, 00:14:16.898 --> 00:14:18.400 but you just got the impression 00:14:18.441 --> 00:14:20.151 that obviously we're not gonna get any fingerprints 00:14:20.193 --> 00:14:23.029 off anything here because it's all been cleaned. 00:14:24.948 --> 00:14:26.533 - As we get to talking here 00:14:26.574 --> 00:14:27.993 and you find out more about Angelo, 00:14:28.034 --> 00:14:30.328 there is one--there are two things about him 00:14:30.370 --> 00:14:34.165 that don't fit into what type of person he is. 00:14:34.207 --> 00:14:37.043 One is the excellent job he does in his line of work. 00:14:37.085 --> 00:14:41.256 And two is, he's so particular. 00:14:41.297 --> 00:14:42.757 Meticulous. 00:14:42.799 --> 00:14:44.676 He probably cleans his whole entire house 00:14:44.718 --> 00:14:46.553 about three or four times a week. 00:14:46.594 --> 00:14:48.596 - We had the print guys come out 00:14:48.638 --> 00:14:50.015 and nothing. 00:14:50.056 --> 00:14:52.350 There was no prints for-- of anything, not even him. 00:14:52.392 --> 00:14:54.519 - The man authorities have been watching closely 00:14:54.561 --> 00:14:56.229 is Buono. 00:14:56.271 --> 00:14:59.190 Bianchi lived with him during some of the killings. 00:14:59.232 --> 00:15:00.984 But investigators have not been able 00:15:01.026 --> 00:15:03.194 to come up with any goods on Buono, 00:15:03.236 --> 00:15:05.196 even though his house was searched. 00:15:05.238 --> 00:15:08.366 - At their news conference on April 23rd, 00:15:08.408 --> 00:15:11.036 Los Angeles Police Chief Daryl Gates indicated 00:15:11.077 --> 00:15:14.414 that Angelo Buono, Mr. Bianchi's cousin, 00:15:14.456 --> 00:15:15.957 was a suspect. 00:15:15.999 --> 00:15:18.126 He remains in that category today. 00:15:19.294 --> 00:15:21.796 - I sure would classify him as a suspect. 00:15:21.838 --> 00:15:24.924 He's had a relationship with Mr. Bianchi. 00:15:24.966 --> 00:15:26.384 And from other things that we've learned, 00:15:26.426 --> 00:15:27.802 I think he is a suspect. 00:15:29.804 --> 00:15:32.015 - I'm positive there were two guys. 00:15:32.057 --> 00:15:34.100 Our investigation supported two guys. 00:15:34.893 --> 00:15:37.062 But I have no evidence. 00:15:37.103 --> 00:15:39.522 I have nothing on Angelo Buono. 00:15:39.564 --> 00:15:42.108 We only get the word of Kenny Bianchi. 00:15:42.150 --> 00:15:45.195 - Who killed the second one? - Angelo. 00:15:49.407 --> 00:15:52.243 - Ken, when he moved out of Angelo's house 00:15:52.285 --> 00:15:54.704 and into his little place in Glendale, 00:15:54.746 --> 00:15:57.248 there was all these diplomas on his wall. 00:15:57.290 --> 00:15:59.751 * * 00:15:59.793 --> 00:16:02.003 Ken told me he was a psychotherapist. 00:16:02.045 --> 00:16:05.674 And I said, "But you don't have a job doing this." 00:16:05.715 --> 00:16:07.717 He goes, "Oh, no. The patients come here and see me." 00:16:07.759 --> 00:16:09.511 "When do they do that?" 00:16:09.552 --> 00:16:10.845 He goes, "Well, at night," 00:16:10.887 --> 00:16:12.222 Even though he said 00:16:12.263 --> 00:16:14.641 he would take care of his clients at night, 00:16:14.683 --> 00:16:16.393 it just didn't seem right. 00:16:16.434 --> 00:16:17.727 'Cause he was never working. 00:16:17.769 --> 00:16:19.896 He was never doing that job. 00:16:22.899 --> 00:16:26.111 - In April, after he got arrested in Bellingham, 00:16:26.152 --> 00:16:27.362 they had written a search warrant 00:16:27.404 --> 00:16:29.906 along with Bellingham PD up there. 00:16:29.948 --> 00:16:31.116 And they had brought 00:16:31.157 --> 00:16:33.284 quite a bit of stuff back down. 00:16:33.326 --> 00:16:36.830 Bianchi had these books on multiple personalities, 00:16:36.871 --> 00:16:38.957 a lot of psychology books, 00:16:38.999 --> 00:16:41.001 reference books on psychology. 00:16:41.042 --> 00:16:45.005 A diploma saying he was a doctor of psychology. 00:16:45.046 --> 00:16:48.633 There was a transcript from Cal State Northridge 00:16:48.675 --> 00:16:52.929 with "Kenneth A. Bianchi," his date of birth on it. 00:16:52.971 --> 00:16:54.848 Eventually, we gotta get around and do something 00:16:54.889 --> 00:16:55.974 with this stuff. 00:16:56.016 --> 00:16:57.976 So we dig out this transcript. 00:16:58.018 --> 00:16:59.894 We take it to Northridge, 00:16:59.936 --> 00:17:02.147 to one of the gals from the department it is 00:17:02.188 --> 00:17:04.315 that handles that kind of stuff, 00:17:04.357 --> 00:17:05.984 said, "What can you tell us about this?" 00:17:06.026 --> 00:17:08.069 And once she looks at it she says, 00:17:08.111 --> 00:17:10.030 "Well, it's been altered." 00:17:13.325 --> 00:17:15.785 The student that this transcript belongs to 00:17:15.827 --> 00:17:17.454 is named Steven Walker. 00:17:18.204 --> 00:17:20.206 When Watkins had him under hypnosis, 00:17:20.248 --> 00:17:22.375 he did say that Steve was the guy 00:17:22.417 --> 00:17:23.543 that was doing the killings. 00:17:23.585 --> 00:17:26.212 He wasn't himself. He was Steven Walker. 00:17:26.254 --> 00:17:27.839 - Is there really 00:17:27.881 --> 00:17:30.592 another personality called Steve? 00:17:30.633 --> 00:17:32.010 - Yes. 00:17:32.052 --> 00:17:35.889 I asked him what his name was. He said, "Steve." 00:17:35.930 --> 00:17:38.224 I said, "Steve what?" 00:17:38.266 --> 00:17:39.768 He said, "Walker." 00:17:39.809 --> 00:17:42.479 - We called downtown and said, you know, run this name, 00:17:42.520 --> 00:17:44.481 see if we can find out where he's living. 00:17:44.522 --> 00:17:47.400 So DMV had a, you know, current address on him. 00:17:47.442 --> 00:17:50.111 So we go over and knock on the door. 00:17:50.153 --> 00:17:52.864 And it's Steven Walker. 00:17:58.328 --> 00:18:00.413 - Bianchi, under hypnosis, 00:18:00.455 --> 00:18:03.249 allegedly claimed that he had a childhood playmate 00:18:03.291 --> 00:18:05.585 whom he named Stevie Walker. 00:18:05.627 --> 00:18:08.672 And yet, after we started to check back into that case, 00:18:08.713 --> 00:18:10.632 we found that there was a real Steve Walker. 00:18:12.175 --> 00:18:15.220 - My middle name is Steven. 00:18:15.261 --> 00:18:17.430 And leads to Steven Walker. 00:18:17.472 --> 00:18:19.891 He showed me a university record 00:18:19.933 --> 00:18:21.976 which turned out to be one of mine. 00:18:22.018 --> 00:18:23.728 They asked me if I recognized 00:18:23.770 --> 00:18:26.439 the name that was at the top of the paper. 00:18:26.481 --> 00:18:28.942 I looked up, expecting to see my own name, 00:18:28.983 --> 00:18:31.861 instead seeing the name of Kenneth A. Bianchi. 00:18:32.696 --> 00:18:36.032 - Steven Walker answered an ad that was in the "L.A. Times" 00:18:36.074 --> 00:18:38.451 asking for somebody that was, you know, 00:18:38.493 --> 00:18:40.662 a recent psychiatric graduate. 00:18:40.704 --> 00:18:43.873 You know, he'd sent resumes to a lot of people, he said. 00:18:43.915 --> 00:18:47.836 But this one wanted resume and the transcript. 00:18:49.462 --> 00:18:51.965 He mailed it to this address on Colorado 00:18:52.007 --> 00:18:53.591 to Dr. Kenneth Bianchi. 00:18:53.633 --> 00:18:56.469 - Upon receipt, he took all the records 00:18:56.511 --> 00:18:58.805 and deleted my name from each of them 00:18:58.847 --> 00:19:01.599 and substituted his own in its place. 00:19:01.641 --> 00:19:03.643 - We had to corroborate this story. 00:19:03.685 --> 00:19:04.894 So we go to the "L.A. Times," 00:19:04.936 --> 00:19:06.187 and you can go through the classifieds, 00:19:06.229 --> 00:19:07.647 and we found the ad. 00:19:07.689 --> 00:19:10.650 - We were able prove and document the fact 00:19:10.692 --> 00:19:13.820 that Thomas Steven Walker really did exist 00:19:13.862 --> 00:19:18.283 and it was not an alter ego of Kenneth Bianchi. 00:19:19.075 --> 00:19:21.619 - Where did you get those diplomas printed up? 00:19:23.330 --> 00:19:26.750 - It was a company over in Hollywood. 00:19:26.791 --> 00:19:29.669 They're actually sold as novelties. 00:19:29.711 --> 00:19:31.254 - Yeah. 'Cause there is no such thing 00:19:31.296 --> 00:19:32.714 as the National Psychiatric Association. 00:19:32.756 --> 00:19:34.174 - Right. 00:19:34.215 --> 00:19:37.552 - And there's no such thing as a doctor of psychiatry. 00:19:37.594 --> 00:19:40.013 I mean, how did you expect to fool anybody 00:19:40.055 --> 00:19:42.349 with such labels? 00:19:42.390 --> 00:19:44.559 - Well, it-- you know, it did for a while. 00:19:44.601 --> 00:19:47.270 - He had positioned himself in a phony business 00:19:47.312 --> 00:19:50.231 as a psychologist in California. 00:19:50.273 --> 00:19:52.150 He had doctored up a transcript 00:19:52.192 --> 00:19:55.570 and false credentials showing he was a psychologist. 00:19:55.612 --> 00:19:57.447 Everything he did was a scam. 00:20:14.714 --> 00:20:16.132 - So basically that was the straw 00:20:16.174 --> 00:20:17.217 that broke the camel's back, 00:20:17.258 --> 00:20:21.221 the Steve Walker truism. 00:20:21.262 --> 00:20:24.724 - Bianchi really was a strong suspect. 00:20:24.766 --> 00:20:26.101 And I think at that point, 00:20:26.142 --> 00:20:29.187 the Los Angeles Police Department investigators 00:20:29.229 --> 00:20:30.730 really thought that Buono was 00:20:30.772 --> 00:20:32.607 one of the two people involved. 00:20:33.608 --> 00:20:35.819 Bianchi had implicated him, 00:20:35.860 --> 00:20:39.364 but Bianchi told so many stories, 00:20:39.406 --> 00:20:41.658 in so many different ways, 00:20:41.700 --> 00:20:43.368 that it was very difficult 00:20:43.410 --> 00:20:45.996 to find anything about him that was credible. 00:20:47.956 --> 00:20:51.126 - Up until then, nobody from L.A. 00:20:51.167 --> 00:20:53.712 had talked to Bianchi at all. 00:20:53.753 --> 00:20:55.714 His attorney wouldn't let them talk to him. 00:20:55.755 --> 00:20:58.967 - The defense attorney is gonna shield his client 00:20:59.009 --> 00:21:01.720 and protect that person from the State. 00:21:01.761 --> 00:21:03.638 They are not gonna be sitting down 00:21:03.680 --> 00:21:06.558 having a free-wheeling conversation with the police. 00:21:07.058 --> 00:21:09.060 - But it'd broken. 00:21:09.102 --> 00:21:10.937 He was coming out of trying to establish 00:21:10.979 --> 00:21:13.273 his insanity defense. 00:21:13.314 --> 00:21:16.026 Obviously, they'd decided, "This isn't gonna work. 00:21:16.067 --> 00:21:18.194 Something's gonna have to happen here." 00:21:18.820 --> 00:21:20.447 His attorney must have explained to him 00:21:20.488 --> 00:21:21.740 that that wasn't gonna fly. 00:21:21.781 --> 00:21:23.783 - You know, you really picked bad timing 00:21:23.825 --> 00:21:26.369 because had you been around at the time that I was arguing 00:21:26.411 --> 00:21:27.454 with my lawyer back and forth, 00:21:27.495 --> 00:21:28.872 day in and day out, 00:21:28.913 --> 00:21:30.457 the fact that he's trying to tell me 00:21:30.498 --> 00:21:32.459 that there might be something wrong with me 00:21:32.500 --> 00:21:34.794 and that he wanted to get another opinion. 00:21:34.836 --> 00:21:36.463 And I kept telling him, "There's nothing wrong with me. 00:21:36.504 --> 00:21:37.672 "Don't you dare enter a plea 00:21:37.714 --> 00:21:38.798 "of not guilty by reason of insanity. 00:21:38.840 --> 00:21:40.383 "Just keep it to a not guilty plea, 00:21:40.425 --> 00:21:41.926 and just leave things as they are." 00:21:43.094 --> 00:21:44.596 - If he went to trial, 00:21:44.637 --> 00:21:47.182 and had pled not guilty by reason of insanity, 00:21:47.223 --> 00:21:49.934 and the jury did not buy the insanity plea, 00:21:49.976 --> 00:21:52.145 he would then be subject to the death penalty. 00:21:52.187 --> 00:21:55.648 And I knew that if we gave up the death penalty, 00:21:55.690 --> 00:21:57.984 we could facilitate a two-state agreement. 00:21:58.026 --> 00:22:01.112 What it would be-- he would plead guilty here 00:22:01.154 --> 00:22:02.656 on both counts of murder. 00:22:02.697 --> 00:22:03.948 And he would have to cooperate 00:22:03.990 --> 00:22:06.534 in the prosecution of Angelo Buono. 00:22:08.328 --> 00:22:10.538 We talked about it with California. 00:22:10.580 --> 00:22:12.916 And so I ran it by the defense and they agreed. 00:22:12.957 --> 00:22:15.543 And so I drew up two agreements. 00:22:16.127 --> 00:22:18.755 First agreement was that he would sit 00:22:18.797 --> 00:22:21.841 through interviews for the California authorities. 00:22:21.883 --> 00:22:24.678 And if he did all that, and we were all satisfied, 00:22:24.719 --> 00:22:27.180 we could then get into the second which was 00:22:27.222 --> 00:22:28.973 the pleas with both states. 00:22:29.683 --> 00:22:30.850 - But somebody had communicated 00:22:30.892 --> 00:22:33.061 with his attorney who agreed 00:22:33.103 --> 00:22:34.396 to let him be interviewed. 00:22:34.437 --> 00:22:36.856 - Los Angeles police officials investigating 00:22:36.898 --> 00:22:38.566 Bianchi's reported connection to several 00:22:38.608 --> 00:22:40.235 of the Hillside Strangling murders, 00:22:40.276 --> 00:22:42.404 were back in Bellingham today. 00:22:42.445 --> 00:22:44.948 - Personally, I had a strong feeling 00:22:44.990 --> 00:22:46.783 that we needed to evaluate this guy 00:22:46.825 --> 00:22:49.285 as to his worth as a witness. 00:22:49.327 --> 00:22:53.915 If he's gonna be basically the case against Buono, 00:22:53.957 --> 00:22:55.458 he's gotta have some worth to him. 00:23:15.687 --> 00:23:18.148 - When we started, he had that impression that 00:23:18.189 --> 00:23:22.277 "I'm the star of this thing. I'm gonna run it. 00:23:22.318 --> 00:23:26.823 And you guys are here asking me for my help." 00:23:39.210 --> 00:23:41.046 - Well, you don't want your suspect running 00:23:41.087 --> 00:23:43.089 the investigation. 00:23:43.131 --> 00:23:44.591 You just kind of put him in his place, 00:23:44.632 --> 00:23:47.093 make him aware that he is-- 00:23:47.135 --> 00:23:48.970 he is the underling in this thing. 00:23:49.012 --> 00:23:50.388 You know, you're-- 00:23:50.430 --> 00:23:52.682 you're the one that's fighting for your life, idiot. 00:23:55.518 --> 00:23:56.686 - We decided we'd go chronologically 00:23:56.728 --> 00:23:58.480 through the cases in Los Angeles. 00:24:10.617 --> 00:24:17.082 - I believed that what he told us was the truth. 00:24:17.123 --> 00:24:19.918 I mean, he ran into detail with the LAPD cases. 00:24:19.959 --> 00:24:22.128 He admits they used handcuffs. 00:24:29.761 --> 00:24:31.596 - So the marks on the wrists are handcuffs. 00:24:31.638 --> 00:24:34.557 They used duct tape on the victims. 00:24:49.698 --> 00:24:52.492 - After being up there and meeting him, 00:24:52.534 --> 00:24:56.037 he was an overly-confident, sleazy, individual 00:24:56.079 --> 00:24:57.330 to start with, and we kind of broke 00:24:57.372 --> 00:24:58.707 him down a bit. 00:24:58.748 --> 00:25:01.960 His confidence got erased to some degree. 00:25:02.002 --> 00:25:03.837 At the end I told him, 00:25:03.878 --> 00:25:06.965 "You know, it really galls me to spare you your life, 00:25:07.007 --> 00:25:08.591 "but it appears that it's something 00:25:08.633 --> 00:25:10.218 "we're gonna have to do in order to get 00:25:10.260 --> 00:25:11.553 Angelo out of society." 00:25:12.387 --> 00:25:14.806 And after that, they pled him guilty. 00:25:14.848 --> 00:25:17.100 - In what turned out to be a surprise move, 00:25:17.142 --> 00:25:20.061 Bianchi changed his plea in the double murder charge 00:25:20.103 --> 00:25:22.897 from not guilty by reason of insanity to guilty. 00:25:22.939 --> 00:25:24.315 - Kenneth Bianchi, 00:25:24.357 --> 00:25:26.401 an accused murderer in Washington state, 00:25:26.443 --> 00:25:27.777 pleaded guilty to five 00:25:27.819 --> 00:25:29.696 of the Hillside Strangler killings. 00:25:30.363 --> 00:25:33.533 - He agreed to plead guilty to our cases 00:25:33.575 --> 00:25:36.077 and to five cases in California 00:25:36.119 --> 00:25:38.330 if he had the death penalty taken off. 00:25:49.299 --> 00:25:52.010 - Well, we had a difficult time giving up the death penalty 00:25:52.052 --> 00:25:54.262 in this case, to be real honest. 00:25:54.304 --> 00:25:56.014 I had never seen anyone that merited 00:25:56.056 --> 00:25:57.515 the death penalty more than he. 00:25:57.557 --> 00:25:59.768 But we all felt it was for the common good. 00:25:59.809 --> 00:26:01.478 My jurisdiction's the state of Washington, 00:26:01.519 --> 00:26:02.937 and I'm concerned about the state. 00:26:02.979 --> 00:26:05.940 But California has citizens also, 00:26:05.982 --> 00:26:09.361 and we thought this would protect both states. 00:26:09.402 --> 00:26:12.197 He was sentenced to two consecutive life terms 00:26:12.238 --> 00:26:13.740 and he'd have to testify truthfully 00:26:13.782 --> 00:26:15.700 against Angelo Buono. 00:26:16.785 --> 00:26:19.412 - I now way can I take away the pain 00:26:19.454 --> 00:26:22.082 that I've given to others. 00:26:22.123 --> 00:26:26.086 And in no way can I expect forgiveness from anybody. 00:26:30.298 --> 00:26:34.803 To even begin to try and live with myself, 00:26:34.844 --> 00:26:37.138 I have to take responsibility for what I've done. 00:26:37.180 --> 00:26:40.433 And I have to do everything I can 00:26:40.475 --> 00:26:42.811 to get Angelo Buono. 00:26:44.896 --> 00:26:46.606 - We were in communication with Bellingham. 00:26:46.648 --> 00:26:50.235 We said, "As soon as he pleads guilty, let us know." 00:26:50.276 --> 00:26:53.029 So they called and said, "He's pled guilty." 00:26:53.071 --> 00:26:54.990 We went and arrested Buono. 00:27:01.413 --> 00:27:02.747 - I got a phone call. 00:27:02.789 --> 00:27:04.958 Said, "Angelo Buono is going to be arrested." 00:27:05.000 --> 00:27:08.044 And so I immediately went out to Angelo Buono's place. 00:27:09.671 --> 00:27:12.465 And when I got out there, I discovered I wasn't alone. 00:27:12.507 --> 00:27:14.300 - Police officers and sheriff's deputies 00:27:14.342 --> 00:27:16.302 who had been trailing Buono for some time, 00:27:16.344 --> 00:27:18.304 swooped down on his home and trim shop 00:27:18.346 --> 00:27:20.181 at about 10:20 this morning to arrest him. 00:27:20.223 --> 00:27:22.142 - Buono was served with a warrant, 00:27:22.183 --> 00:27:24.853 charging him with multiple felony counts 00:27:24.894 --> 00:27:26.855 relating to the Hillside Strangler murders. 00:27:28.565 --> 00:27:30.525 - L.A. wanted this publicized, 00:27:30.567 --> 00:27:33.486 the fact that they'd made this arrest. 00:27:33.528 --> 00:27:36.031 - That's just typical of them. 00:27:36.614 --> 00:27:37.949 You know, so far as they were concerned, 00:27:37.991 --> 00:27:40.410 at that point the case was solved. 00:27:41.119 --> 00:27:42.746 - Looking back now, I guess, you could say 00:27:42.787 --> 00:27:44.914 that, you know, Los Angeles County 00:27:44.956 --> 00:27:46.958 could breathe a sigh of relief 00:27:47.000 --> 00:27:49.878 that this was hopefully finally over. 00:27:52.130 --> 00:27:54.632 But something sounds too good, it's too good. 00:27:54.674 --> 00:27:58.178 * * 00:28:02.098 --> 00:28:04.392 - When the more and more publicity came out, 00:28:04.434 --> 00:28:05.685 especially down in Los Angeles, 00:28:05.727 --> 00:28:08.980 and naturally since it's a part of that, 00:28:09.022 --> 00:28:10.774 it came out up here, in regard to things 00:28:10.815 --> 00:28:12.650 that were supposed to be, you know, 00:28:12.692 --> 00:28:14.861 kept within a certain circle. 00:28:14.903 --> 00:28:16.863 When the stuff really started to leak out 00:28:16.905 --> 00:28:19.699 with the interviews, I felt very uncomfortable. 00:28:20.408 --> 00:28:21.743 My God, I'm telling all my personal business 00:28:21.785 --> 00:28:23.203 to the whole world, you know, 00:28:23.244 --> 00:28:24.829 and it's not their business. 00:28:24.871 --> 00:28:26.956 You know, it's not the world's business. 00:28:26.998 --> 00:28:28.708 - 27-year-old Kenneth Bianchi 00:28:28.750 --> 00:28:30.877 charged with two homicides here in Bellingham. 00:28:30.919 --> 00:28:33.463 He says he will waive extradition to California 00:28:33.505 --> 00:28:34.839 and travel down there to testify 00:28:34.881 --> 00:28:36.966 against his cousin, Angelo Buono, 00:28:37.008 --> 00:28:38.760 whom Bianchi says was an accomplice 00:28:38.802 --> 00:28:40.428 in a series of killings known 00:28:40.470 --> 00:28:43.598 as the Los Angeles Hillside Stranglings. 00:28:43.640 --> 00:28:45.600 - They flew a special airplane up here. 00:28:45.642 --> 00:28:48.103 I signed the extradition papers on the wing of the plane. 00:28:48.937 --> 00:28:51.106 We sent him back down to California 00:28:51.147 --> 00:28:52.816 as soon as we could. 00:28:55.443 --> 00:28:57.570 - We had Bianchi in a cell 00:28:57.612 --> 00:28:59.781 in the hospital section of the county jail. 00:28:59.823 --> 00:29:02.575 And we had to authorize anybody 00:29:02.617 --> 00:29:04.828 that was gonna come in as a visitor. 00:29:04.869 --> 00:29:07.288 So one day he calls and he said, 00:29:07.330 --> 00:29:08.665 "I need to talk to you guys. 00:29:08.707 --> 00:29:10.917 I'd like somebody put on my visiting list." 00:29:10.959 --> 00:29:13.753 You know, basically, he, you know, he needed-- 00:29:13.795 --> 00:29:16.006 He said he needed company, and he had nobody to talk to, 00:29:16.047 --> 00:29:17.257 and all this crap. 00:29:17.298 --> 00:29:18.800 So we go over to see him. 00:29:18.842 --> 00:29:21.136 And he says, "This gal sent me this letter." 00:29:21.177 --> 00:29:24.806 So he's got this letter from Veronica Compton. 00:29:26.558 --> 00:29:28.101 She wants to come and visit him. 00:29:28.143 --> 00:29:29.602 We ran a record check on her. 00:29:29.644 --> 00:29:31.354 She had one arrest for drunk driving. 00:29:31.855 --> 00:29:34.691 So we said, "Yeah, put her on the visiting list." 00:29:36.735 --> 00:29:39.654 - Veronica Compton was a playwright in California 00:29:39.696 --> 00:29:41.364 and somehow got the opportunity 00:29:41.406 --> 00:29:44.367 to visit him in jail in Los Angeles. 00:29:44.409 --> 00:29:46.077 She had befriended Bianchi 00:29:46.119 --> 00:29:48.747 was trying to do a play about him. 00:29:48.788 --> 00:29:50.832 And he was trying to use her. 00:29:50.874 --> 00:29:52.459 He wanted her to come to Bellingham 00:29:52.500 --> 00:29:54.502 and to kill a woman her by strangling her 00:29:54.544 --> 00:29:55.879 to make it look as though 00:29:55.920 --> 00:29:57.964 the Hillside Strangler's still alive and well. 00:29:58.006 --> 00:30:02.761 * * 00:30:13.104 --> 00:30:16.107 I first became aware 00:30:16.149 --> 00:30:20.904 of Ken Bianchi on the news. 00:30:20.945 --> 00:30:24.991 And it was him talking in court 00:30:25.033 --> 00:30:28.662 with teardrops streaming down his cheeks, 00:30:28.703 --> 00:30:31.539 saying how sorry he was. 00:30:32.207 --> 00:30:35.960 - I can't find the words to express the sorrow I feel 00:30:36.002 --> 00:30:37.712 for what I've done. 00:30:38.421 --> 00:30:41.716 - And that was the first image that I ever saw of him. 00:30:45.220 --> 00:30:49.224 I had been writing and producing shows in Hollywood, 00:30:49.265 --> 00:30:52.227 and I had written a play 00:30:52.268 --> 00:30:54.771 about a female serial killer 00:30:54.813 --> 00:30:56.606 called "The Mutilated Cutter." 00:30:58.692 --> 00:31:00.193 And in this play, 00:31:00.235 --> 00:31:04.739 the woman gets away with murdering other women. 00:31:05.490 --> 00:31:07.701 I had hoped that I could penetrate 00:31:07.742 --> 00:31:10.704 the mind of a serial killer 00:31:10.745 --> 00:31:16.334 and try to find some answer 00:31:16.376 --> 00:31:20.213 as to why anyone would be compelled 00:31:20.255 --> 00:31:22.298 to kill another human being. 00:31:22.340 --> 00:31:27.137 And then I set about getting an interview with Bianchi. 00:31:27.178 --> 00:31:30.807 I wrote a letter that I thought would catch his interest. 00:31:30.849 --> 00:31:34.269 I got a letter back from him and a phone call. 00:31:34.310 --> 00:31:37.147 And he said, "Please, I want you to come visit me." 00:31:51.745 --> 00:31:56.249 - I remember I wore all white, looking very pristine. 00:31:56.291 --> 00:31:58.084 A white dress with lace. 00:31:58.126 --> 00:32:01.546 He did not look anything like what I thought 00:32:01.588 --> 00:32:02.714 he would look like. 00:32:02.756 --> 00:32:05.425 I had expected someone 00:32:05.467 --> 00:32:07.302 with kind of wild eyes, 00:32:07.344 --> 00:32:09.846 scary-looking like a bogeyman. 00:32:09.888 --> 00:32:13.808 And instead he looked like your next-door neighbor. 00:32:13.850 --> 00:32:16.061 A regular Joe Blow. 00:32:16.770 --> 00:32:18.980 He's standing on the opposite side 00:32:19.022 --> 00:32:21.941 of this very thick tempered glass. 00:32:21.983 --> 00:32:24.652 I'm standing, and he says, "Sit down." 00:32:25.278 --> 00:32:28.990 And I said, "Well, what was your opinion of my play?" 00:32:29.032 --> 00:32:35.705 And he said--I'll never forget these words ever. 00:32:36.581 --> 00:32:40.585 "I know you. 00:32:40.627 --> 00:32:43.046 "I know you and I know who you are. 00:32:45.173 --> 00:32:47.884 This is a true story, isn't it?" 00:32:47.926 --> 00:32:50.178 Well, I was totally taken aback. 00:32:50.220 --> 00:32:51.554 I was in shock. 00:32:51.596 --> 00:32:53.098 How could anyone think it was a true story? 00:32:53.139 --> 00:32:56.476 I--it's a fiction, for God's sakes. 00:32:56.518 --> 00:32:58.561 And I'm, like, shocked that here is 00:32:58.603 --> 00:33:00.897 a serial killer thinking I'm just like him. 00:33:00.939 --> 00:33:04.234 He's smiling up a storm and he's just having a ball. 00:33:04.275 --> 00:33:06.945 He really believes that I'm a serial killer 00:33:06.986 --> 00:33:09.280 and believes that I'm just like him. 00:33:10.281 --> 00:33:13.827 Ken was, and is, I believe, 00:33:13.868 --> 00:33:17.205 remarkably perceptive to another person's weaknesses. 00:33:17.914 --> 00:33:19.791 As much as I tried to conceal my loneliness, 00:33:19.833 --> 00:33:21.543 I think he could sense that. 00:33:21.584 --> 00:33:24.004 And he started seducing me. 00:33:24.045 --> 00:33:27.215 He began consuming my world, calling me all the time. 00:33:27.257 --> 00:33:29.801 It disarmed me and... 00:33:32.178 --> 00:33:33.555 I felt safe. 00:33:33.596 --> 00:33:36.224 He didn't talk about mayhem or murder 00:33:36.266 --> 00:33:38.309 or anything like that. 00:33:41.354 --> 00:33:45.900 About a week and a half go by, intermittent phone calls. 00:33:45.942 --> 00:33:48.445 I get a phone call from a woman I'd never heard of. 00:33:48.486 --> 00:33:53.366 And she said, "You're going to tell the truth at last 00:33:53.408 --> 00:33:56.703 how my son is really innocent." 00:33:56.745 --> 00:34:00.540 She said, "He told me the truth 00:34:00.582 --> 00:34:03.209 "that you were the woman that he was with 00:34:03.251 --> 00:34:06.546 "during the nights of the murders that Buono did. 00:34:06.588 --> 00:34:08.715 "And you have alibies. 00:34:08.757 --> 00:34:11.384 "And you're gonna prove he's innocent. 00:34:11.426 --> 00:34:13.219 Thank you, thank you." 00:34:13.261 --> 00:34:16.139 Next day, I go straight to the jail 00:34:16.181 --> 00:34:17.891 and I am fuming. 00:34:17.932 --> 00:34:20.643 I said, "What the hell did you do, 00:34:20.685 --> 00:34:22.145 "you *? 00:34:22.187 --> 00:34:23.897 You lied to this woman." 00:34:23.938 --> 00:34:28.318 "Please. Please, Veronica, please. 00:34:28.360 --> 00:34:31.404 "She's dying. This was her dying wish 00:34:31.446 --> 00:34:34.866 that I would be proven innocent of these horrible crimes." 00:34:34.908 --> 00:34:36.910 Well, that pulled at my heartstrings. 00:34:36.951 --> 00:34:38.828 And then he begins these tears, 00:34:38.870 --> 00:34:41.247 you know, saying, 00:34:41.289 --> 00:34:46.419 "Veronica, I didn't tell you this part, but... 00:34:46.461 --> 00:34:49.089 "Angelo Buono's put a contract out on me, 00:34:49.130 --> 00:34:51.925 and I'm going to be dead within 24 hours. 00:34:51.966 --> 00:34:53.760 "You'll never see me again. 00:34:53.802 --> 00:34:56.304 I'm gonna die before my dying mother dies." 00:34:59.265 --> 00:35:03.645 "Well, Ken, I don't want you to die. 00:35:03.687 --> 00:35:05.397 What can I do to help?" 00:35:07.816 --> 00:35:10.527 And then he stands up, 00:35:10.568 --> 00:35:12.320 and out of his pants-- 00:35:12.362 --> 00:35:15.240 he had a little cut in his Levi's 00:35:15.281 --> 00:35:17.659 and he pulls out this little piece of paper. 00:35:18.201 --> 00:35:20.620 And on the paper he has written notes. 00:35:20.662 --> 00:35:22.622 He hands it up like this. 00:35:22.664 --> 00:35:25.333 He's looking around to make sure no one's watching. 00:35:25.875 --> 00:35:28.795 He puts it up there, and he said, 00:35:28.837 --> 00:35:30.130 "Copy this down." 00:35:30.171 --> 00:35:32.757 I didn't even know what I was writing down. 00:35:32.799 --> 00:35:34.300 I'm not in a good place. 00:35:34.342 --> 00:35:35.927 Not sleeping well, 00:35:35.969 --> 00:35:39.014 I had been doing cocaine, I'd had some drinks. 00:35:39.681 --> 00:35:42.726 I'm copying down these notes and not knowing what they are. 00:35:42.767 --> 00:35:44.477 He said, "Get rid of them. Stash them." 00:35:44.519 --> 00:35:47.355 So I stash them in my panties, 00:35:47.397 --> 00:35:51.985 get outside of the jail, go home, open the papers, 00:35:52.027 --> 00:35:54.029 and they're murder notes. 00:35:56.698 --> 00:35:58.825 He hatched this plan. 00:35:59.784 --> 00:36:04.164 I was going to replicate a murder 00:36:04.205 --> 00:36:07.709 to make it look like he was innocent. 00:36:16.593 --> 00:36:20.138 - When Ken wanted me to go out and kill someone, 00:36:20.180 --> 00:36:22.974 things just kind of snowballed from there. 00:36:23.933 --> 00:36:26.728 - A 26-year-old woman was nearly strangled to death 00:36:26.770 --> 00:36:29.314 in a room at a downtown Bellingham motel. 00:36:29.356 --> 00:36:31.149 Prosecutors charged that the assailant, 00:36:31.191 --> 00:36:33.401 24-year-old Veronica Lynn Compton, 00:36:33.443 --> 00:36:35.487 was trying to create the appearance 00:36:35.528 --> 00:36:38.573 that the person responsible for the 1978 deaths 00:36:38.615 --> 00:36:40.575 of two local women was still at large. 00:36:40.617 --> 00:36:45.038 - His plan was I was to wear a disguise, 00:36:45.080 --> 00:36:48.083 find a woman like one of his victims, 00:36:48.124 --> 00:36:50.126 kill them, 00:36:50.168 --> 00:36:54.714 and leave information 00:36:54.756 --> 00:36:56.758 that proves I'm the real murderer. 00:36:56.800 --> 00:36:57.926 If we could establish 00:36:57.967 --> 00:37:00.095 that the real murderer was on the loose, 00:37:00.136 --> 00:37:01.805 then, obviously, he couldn't be guilty. 00:37:01.846 --> 00:37:04.391 And then he could come out of the prison system. 00:37:04.432 --> 00:37:05.684 And he could come rescue me. 00:37:05.725 --> 00:37:09.020 That was the promise. That was the idea. 00:37:09.062 --> 00:37:13.400 I could share written materials with Bianchi, 00:37:13.441 --> 00:37:17.362 so I had lent him one of my books. 00:37:17.404 --> 00:37:21.366 And he said he read it, returned it to me. 00:37:21.408 --> 00:37:22.784 I took it home. 00:37:22.826 --> 00:37:25.912 I get a phone call from him and he said, 00:37:25.954 --> 00:37:29.332 "Go to the binding. You'll see a little string. 00:37:29.374 --> 00:37:31.793 Pull it out." I pulled it out. 00:37:31.835 --> 00:37:33.962 And in a glove-- 00:37:34.004 --> 00:37:35.880 you know, it was just a partial finger 00:37:35.922 --> 00:37:39.092 of a plastic glove like the nurses use-- 00:37:39.134 --> 00:37:42.637 there was his ejaculate in there. 00:37:42.679 --> 00:37:46.391 And he said, "Take that with you. 00:37:46.433 --> 00:37:50.937 And put that on the person when you're done." 00:37:52.355 --> 00:37:55.442 I didn't do it. I flushed it down the toilet. 00:37:55.483 --> 00:37:59.195 It was disgusting to me, but that was his plan. 00:38:04.367 --> 00:38:06.161 I flew out to Bellingham, Washington 00:38:06.202 --> 00:38:07.871 as he instructed, 00:38:07.912 --> 00:38:10.957 went to where he told me to go, 00:38:10.999 --> 00:38:14.878 saw the woman like he described, 00:38:14.919 --> 00:38:16.921 did what he said. 00:38:16.963 --> 00:38:20.342 He showed me how to do a noose. "You just pull it." 00:38:20.383 --> 00:38:21.676 What he failed to tell me 00:38:21.718 --> 00:38:23.762 is that in order to strangle someone 00:38:23.803 --> 00:38:26.389 with a noose like that-- it's a man's tie. 00:38:26.431 --> 00:38:30.226 You're supposed to hold it this way, 'kay? 00:38:30.268 --> 00:38:31.394 I didn't know that. 00:38:31.436 --> 00:38:32.812 So I just am holding it this way. 00:38:32.854 --> 00:38:35.774 Well, it knots on itself and it doesn't get tight. 00:38:35.815 --> 00:38:38.860 And she pushed me off of her and she got out. 00:38:38.902 --> 00:38:42.072 - The victim was Kim Breed, a part-time waitress 00:38:42.113 --> 00:38:44.908 who says the defendant tried to strangle her with a rope. 00:38:48.119 --> 00:38:51.373 - I got a call that a young woman had been 00:38:51.414 --> 00:38:53.416 very close to have been strangled to death 00:38:53.458 --> 00:38:57.170 in a local motel, sort of a rundown hotel 00:38:57.212 --> 00:38:59.756 in the city of Bellingham. 00:38:59.798 --> 00:39:02.550 The officers started investigating immediately 00:39:02.592 --> 00:39:05.136 and identified Veronica Compton. 00:39:05.178 --> 00:39:08.556 We did search warrants on her house and apartment 00:39:08.598 --> 00:39:11.726 and we found some really bizarre writings. 00:39:11.768 --> 00:39:13.895 - Notes found in Compton's apartment 00:39:13.937 --> 00:39:16.106 contained information about the Hillside crimes 00:39:16.147 --> 00:39:18.525 known only to police and Kenneth Bianchi. 00:39:18.566 --> 00:39:20.026 - Veronica's plan was to make it look 00:39:20.068 --> 00:39:21.778 as though the Hillside Strangler was 00:39:21.820 --> 00:39:23.947 still alive and well in Bellingham. 00:39:23.989 --> 00:39:27.075 And then Bianchi could somehow use this to his benefit 00:39:27.117 --> 00:39:29.703 saying that he really wasn't the person that did it. 00:39:29.744 --> 00:39:32.580 I think that it was not just his doing. 00:39:32.622 --> 00:39:34.499 I think he wanted her to do this 00:39:34.541 --> 00:39:36.418 and she thought it was a wonderful idea, 00:39:36.459 --> 00:39:38.503 which is hard to comprehend. 00:39:38.545 --> 00:39:40.130 - Compton, according to the State, 00:39:40.171 --> 00:39:41.589 committed the copycat crime 00:39:41.631 --> 00:39:43.466 out of love for Kenneth Bianchi, 00:39:43.508 --> 00:39:44.718 who has admitted to the murders 00:39:44.759 --> 00:39:46.511 of Diane Wilder and Karen Mandic 00:39:46.553 --> 00:39:48.221 two years ago, and to several 00:39:48.263 --> 00:39:50.807 of the Hillside Stranglings in Los Angeles. 00:39:50.849 --> 00:39:53.143 - Was I enthralled? Was I in love? 00:39:53.184 --> 00:39:54.769 Absolutely not. 00:39:54.811 --> 00:39:57.480 It's not like you're attracted to someone 00:39:57.522 --> 00:40:00.900 and oh, aren't they, you know, so handsome 00:40:00.942 --> 00:40:02.861 and *y and virile or whatever. 00:40:02.902 --> 00:40:04.779 I didn't find him that way at all. 00:40:04.821 --> 00:40:06.948 To me it was for a story. 00:40:06.990 --> 00:40:09.034 You know, he was just a project. 00:40:10.452 --> 00:40:12.579 Yes, Ken had power over me. 00:40:12.620 --> 00:40:14.873 The entire time. 00:40:14.914 --> 00:40:18.626 You're doing the opposite of every instinct in your body. 00:40:18.668 --> 00:40:22.339 I think that I was susceptible, but... 00:40:22.380 --> 00:40:24.716 it was really the drugs, I think, 00:40:24.758 --> 00:40:28.219 and the pills and the alcohol, all--and lack of sleep-- 00:40:28.261 --> 00:40:30.597 kind of just happening-- too much. 00:40:30.638 --> 00:40:35.602 And it was just a perfect storm, I guess, for mayhem. 00:40:38.021 --> 00:40:40.482 - I began extradition proceedings, 00:40:40.523 --> 00:40:41.691 brought her back here, 00:40:41.733 --> 00:40:43.151 and tried her and convicted her 00:40:43.193 --> 00:40:45.695 of attempted murder in the first degree. 00:40:45.737 --> 00:40:48.657 She was sentenced to 25 or 30 years in prison. 00:40:52.786 --> 00:40:54.454 - They put her in a minimum security 00:40:54.496 --> 00:40:56.456 women's facility. 00:40:56.498 --> 00:40:58.792 Sometime after she'd been convicted, 00:40:58.833 --> 00:41:00.126 they called me and they said, 00:41:00.168 --> 00:41:02.170 "She's escaped and she's heading south 00:41:02.212 --> 00:41:04.047 on her way to Mexico." 00:41:04.631 --> 00:41:07.008 - I got a phone call that my son was put 00:41:07.050 --> 00:41:08.385 in a juvenile facility. 00:41:08.426 --> 00:41:11.096 And to me that was a mother's worst nightmare. 00:41:11.137 --> 00:41:15.016 And I escaped specifically to break him out 00:41:15.058 --> 00:41:17.227 of a juvenile facility, 00:41:17.268 --> 00:41:19.145 start a legal business, 00:41:19.187 --> 00:41:21.648 and start a clean life in Mexico. 00:41:21.690 --> 00:41:23.692 All security systems have flaws. 00:41:23.733 --> 00:41:26.903 Anything that man builds, there's always a flaw. 00:41:26.945 --> 00:41:29.322 Where there's a will, there's a way. 00:41:29.364 --> 00:41:30.782 I'm not gonna get into it beyond that. 00:41:30.824 --> 00:41:32.617 I did it. It's not that difficult. 00:41:32.659 --> 00:41:33.994 Anyone can do it. 00:41:34.035 --> 00:41:35.996 - She got arrested just down by the border. 00:41:37.664 --> 00:41:38.915 She got pretty close to the border. 00:41:38.957 --> 00:41:41.710 And then they put her in maximum security. 00:41:43.294 --> 00:41:44.546 - It was bizarre. 00:41:44.587 --> 00:41:46.715 It was truly a very bizarre case. 00:41:46.756 --> 00:41:49.300 To tell you that I could understand her motivation 00:41:49.342 --> 00:41:50.593 is something I can't do. 00:41:51.219 --> 00:41:52.387 She may have thought it would give her 00:41:52.429 --> 00:41:53.888 a great deal of notoriety. 00:41:53.930 --> 00:41:56.599 In fact, Veronica Compton was later dubbed by the media 00:41:56.641 --> 00:41:58.643 The Copycat Strangler. 00:41:59.185 --> 00:42:02.230 - I had attorneys that made up a story 00:42:02.272 --> 00:42:05.108 that I was supposed to rec-- you know, tell 00:42:05.150 --> 00:42:09.112 that it was a publicity stunt because I'm a writer 00:42:09.154 --> 00:42:11.406 and it was all lies. 00:42:11.448 --> 00:42:13.908 It was not a publicity stunt. 00:42:13.950 --> 00:42:17.787 It was a plot by the Hillside Strangler. 00:42:17.829 --> 00:42:20.457 And I tried to enact it and I couldn't. 00:42:20.498 --> 00:42:23.126 And I'm glad I didn't. 00:42:23.168 --> 00:42:26.087 I'm very glad I didn't. 00:42:26.129 --> 00:42:29.591 I was later told that I was the third girl 00:42:29.632 --> 00:42:31.885 that he had done this to. 00:42:31.926 --> 00:42:34.929 I had just taken it further. 00:42:34.971 --> 00:42:39.684 And for that heinous crime I did 23 years in prison, 00:42:39.726 --> 00:42:41.978 almost eight years in isolation. 00:42:44.981 --> 00:42:48.234 Any serial killer has one motive in mind-- 00:42:48.276 --> 00:42:51.488 that's get out of prison. 00:42:51.529 --> 00:42:52.906 They will perform-- 00:42:52.947 --> 00:42:55.867 they will do anything in their power 00:42:55.909 --> 00:43:00.830 to move you, manipulate you, to do their bidding. 00:43:04.709 --> 00:43:09.089 I believed that he was a multiple personality, 00:43:09.130 --> 00:43:11.925 that parts of him were innocent of the crime, 00:43:11.966 --> 00:43:15.970 and they did not know about the guilty part. 00:43:16.012 --> 00:43:19.349 Then later I learned it was all a façade. 00:43:19.391 --> 00:43:21.851 Of course, it was all bullshit. 00:43:21.893 --> 00:43:24.020 You know, we know that now. 00:43:24.062 --> 00:43:27.524 But I fed into it like the rest of the world. 00:43:27.565 --> 00:43:32.070 And, uh, it was a terrible, terrible lie. 00:43:32.112 --> 00:43:36.241 And it was a terrible, terrible exploitation on his part. 00:43:36.282 --> 00:43:38.785 - I pulled all the wings off in Los Angeles 00:43:38.827 --> 00:43:40.495 and left very few trails. 00:43:40.537 --> 00:43:41.746 - Ken was the only one 00:43:41.788 --> 00:43:43.790 that implicated himself to the murders. 00:43:43.832 --> 00:43:46.292 So did Angelo do the murders, too? 00:43:46.334 --> 00:43:49.796 Probably, but I don't know. 00:43:56.553 --> 00:43:58.596 - I knew Angelo was different 00:43:58.638 --> 00:44:00.640 even from our very first meeting. 00:44:00.682 --> 00:44:03.476 But did I think anything of it? 00:44:03.518 --> 00:44:04.811 No. 00:44:05.562 --> 00:44:09.524 I never saw Ken angry. I never saw him mad. 00:44:09.566 --> 00:44:11.985 I never saw that side of him. 00:44:12.027 --> 00:44:15.780 He never talked about wanting to hurt anybody. 00:44:15.822 --> 00:44:18.199 I never saw it. 00:44:18.241 --> 00:44:20.452 I guess the words I want to say is, 00:44:20.493 --> 00:44:21.786 well, it kind of makes sense 00:44:21.828 --> 00:44:25.832 now that Angelo's been arrested for the murders, 00:44:25.874 --> 00:44:30.295 because that personality I could see doing it. 00:44:30.337 --> 00:44:33.423 'Cause he was just different. 00:44:33.465 --> 00:44:35.175 He was strange. 00:44:36.468 --> 00:44:38.553 - Buono wore a jail uniform 00:44:38.595 --> 00:44:40.555 to and from the criminal courts building, 00:44:40.597 --> 00:44:42.140 but was dressed in a black suit 00:44:42.182 --> 00:44:43.391 when he pleaded innocent 00:44:43.433 --> 00:44:45.685 to 26 counts charged against him 00:44:45.727 --> 00:44:47.937 in connection with the murders of ten young women. 00:44:48.730 --> 00:44:52.692 * * 00:44:52.734 --> 00:44:54.736 - I became aware of the Hillside Strangler 00:44:54.778 --> 00:44:57.280 primarily from the news reports. 00:44:57.322 --> 00:44:59.240 Being a criminal defense lawyer, 00:44:59.282 --> 00:45:01.201 I was watching the case fairly closely. 00:45:01.242 --> 00:45:03.578 And then I received a call 00:45:03.620 --> 00:45:05.372 from a fellow criminal defense lawyer 00:45:05.413 --> 00:45:07.832 in Orange County by the name of Jim Brustman. 00:45:07.874 --> 00:45:10.126 And Jim and his partner David Haigh were 00:45:10.168 --> 00:45:11.670 two great lawyers. 00:45:11.711 --> 00:45:13.713 We were all very excited about the case initially. 00:45:13.755 --> 00:45:15.674 You know, when you're a criminal defense lawyer, 00:45:15.715 --> 00:45:17.592 you want to be involved in big cases. 00:45:17.634 --> 00:45:19.427 This was the biggest. 00:45:20.970 --> 00:45:23.264 I thought we had a shot at winning it. 00:45:25.517 --> 00:45:27.477 - At that point, Angelo Buono was probably 00:45:27.519 --> 00:45:31.356 the notorious charged person in Los Angeles 00:45:31.398 --> 00:45:33.316 and possibly the country. 00:45:34.192 --> 00:45:36.611 On that first conversation, 00:45:36.653 --> 00:45:39.531 I'm beginning the very first elements 00:45:39.572 --> 00:45:42.867 of trying to find out who I'm dealing with. 00:45:42.909 --> 00:45:47.205 To me, Angelo Buono was not a frightening person. 00:45:47.247 --> 00:45:51.918 At all times in his presence, I felt perfectly comfortable. 00:45:53.253 --> 00:45:54.838 I certainly didn't read, 00:45:54.879 --> 00:45:57.424 in his eyes and in his demeanor, 00:45:57.465 --> 00:46:00.885 that he was the epitome of evil. 00:46:00.927 --> 00:46:03.179 And I have met people 00:46:03.221 --> 00:46:05.598 where I would make that description. 00:46:05.640 --> 00:46:09.519 I can saw when I looked at Angelo Buono, 00:46:09.561 --> 00:46:12.313 I saw no sign of a cold-blooded murderer. 00:46:14.566 --> 00:46:18.028 He told me where he was from. He told me about family. 00:46:18.069 --> 00:46:20.113 He was careful to point out Bianchi was not 00:46:20.155 --> 00:46:21.990 truly a member of his family, 00:46:22.032 --> 00:46:24.242 that he was actually sort of this foster child, 00:46:24.284 --> 00:46:27.746 adopted, you know, non-cousin. 00:46:27.787 --> 00:46:30.498 It's one of those family things 00:46:30.540 --> 00:46:33.877 that Bianchi has no place to stay 00:46:33.918 --> 00:46:35.253 and Buono puts him up. 00:46:35.295 --> 00:46:38.173 - Somebody made a comment that-- 00:46:38.214 --> 00:46:40.800 that Angelo and I were inseparable. 00:46:41.468 --> 00:46:42.761 That's not true. 00:46:42.802 --> 00:46:45.221 - They weren't out being drinking buddies. 00:46:45.263 --> 00:46:46.890 They weren't doing things together. 00:46:47.640 --> 00:46:49.225 He was not a roommate. 00:46:49.267 --> 00:46:51.311 He was more like a boarder. 00:47:01.321 --> 00:47:03.281 - Once Bianchi left, 00:47:03.323 --> 00:47:05.659 at least as expressed by Buono, 00:47:05.700 --> 00:47:08.995 there was no follow-up. There were no phone calls. 00:47:09.037 --> 00:47:12.957 It's just he's there, and he's gone. 00:47:15.460 --> 00:47:18.338 Killings occur. 00:47:18.380 --> 00:47:20.048 Bianchi leaves town. 00:47:20.090 --> 00:47:21.841 Killings stop. 00:47:22.842 --> 00:47:24.427 Back he goes to Bellingham, 00:47:24.469 --> 00:47:26.971 killings start up again. 00:47:27.013 --> 00:47:29.015 Well, what's the constant there? 00:47:29.557 --> 00:47:32.602 It ain't Buono. It ain't two people. 00:47:32.644 --> 00:47:34.062 It's Bianchi. 00:47:34.104 --> 00:47:36.648 If Bianchi can kill alone in Washington, 00:47:36.690 --> 00:47:39.317 there is no reason that he would need 00:47:39.359 --> 00:47:42.529 Buono to help him in California. 00:47:56.543 --> 00:47:59.504 - When Bianchi was arrested and charged 00:47:59.546 --> 00:48:02.173 with the Hillside Stranglings, 00:48:02.215 --> 00:48:04.843 and then they arrested Buono-- 00:48:04.884 --> 00:48:06.845 in the minds of the media, 00:48:06.886 --> 00:48:10.473 the arrest of Angelo Buono means that he's guilty as hell. 00:48:11.558 --> 00:48:13.476 And they report it like that. 00:48:13.518 --> 00:48:15.270 - And once Bianchi made his appearance, 00:48:15.311 --> 00:48:17.272 he left and the courtroom was made ready 00:48:17.313 --> 00:48:19.232 for his cousin, Angelo Buono. 00:48:19.274 --> 00:48:20.567 - The two prime figures 00:48:20.608 --> 00:48:22.027 in the Hillside Strangler murder case 00:48:22.068 --> 00:48:23.903 in the same courtroom on the same day. 00:48:25.238 --> 00:48:28.116 - I remember a reporter asking Daryl Gates-- 00:48:28.158 --> 00:48:31.870 because he had arranged this huge search 00:48:31.911 --> 00:48:33.705 of Buono's upholstery shop-- 00:48:33.747 --> 00:48:35.206 "What if you're wrong? 00:48:35.248 --> 00:48:37.375 How are you going to ever make this up to Buono?" 00:48:37.417 --> 00:48:39.044 He says, "I don't care." 00:48:39.085 --> 00:48:42.464 I guess he felt that Buono was big enough of a sleazebag 00:48:42.505 --> 00:48:45.050 that he deserved it, I don't know. 00:48:46.134 --> 00:48:51.222 And so Angelo Buono brought a lawsuit against the LAPD, 00:48:51.264 --> 00:48:54.559 a defamation case for ruining his reputation. 00:48:54.601 --> 00:48:58.772 - It was a very highly-publicized case. 00:48:58.813 --> 00:49:01.858 The community's in an uproar. Everybody's scared. 00:49:01.900 --> 00:49:05.070 The police naturally felt pressure to find the killer. 00:49:06.613 --> 00:49:08.823 From a criminal defense standpoint, 00:49:08.865 --> 00:49:12.327 that's one of the things that can be a benefit to you, 00:49:12.369 --> 00:49:15.538 because the police maybe make mistakes 00:49:15.580 --> 00:49:17.957 or jump to conclusions 00:49:17.999 --> 00:49:20.210 that may not have been as rational 00:49:20.251 --> 00:49:23.546 if they had not been under all that pressure. 00:49:23.588 --> 00:49:24.506 I'm not saying that happened here, 00:49:24.547 --> 00:49:26.299 but I'm saying this is a case 00:49:26.341 --> 00:49:28.009 where they could have made mistakes. 00:49:28.051 --> 00:49:29.427 That's human. 00:49:29.469 --> 00:49:30.637 Doesn't make them bad people. 00:49:32.722 --> 00:49:34.349 Early on, one of the main pieces 00:49:34.391 --> 00:49:38.061 of evidence against Angelo was Bianchi's confession 00:49:39.479 --> 00:49:43.066 that his cousin was involved with him in the murders. 00:49:43.108 --> 00:49:46.319 I didn't think Bianchi was telling the truth 00:49:46.361 --> 00:49:49.948 about the stranglings in California. 00:49:49.990 --> 00:49:51.574 Just how he described the scene 00:49:51.616 --> 00:49:52.993 and where the bodies were, 00:49:53.034 --> 00:49:55.203 and all of that just were off. 00:50:14.389 --> 00:50:16.182 - From my point of view, 00:50:16.224 --> 00:50:19.144 the videos of him being in a session 00:50:19.185 --> 00:50:21.521 with a psychiatrist, 00:50:21.563 --> 00:50:24.607 it looked like he wasn't confessing 00:50:24.649 --> 00:50:26.026 to something that he did. 00:50:26.067 --> 00:50:29.988 He's confessing to something that he read that he did. 00:50:30.030 --> 00:50:32.115 And there's a big difference. 00:50:33.074 --> 00:50:35.702 To me it was obvious he'd been given police reports. 00:50:36.953 --> 00:50:38.330 With the exception 00:50:38.371 --> 00:50:40.123 of the first girl, 00:50:40.165 --> 00:50:45.253 without the use of the Los Angeles material, 00:50:45.295 --> 00:50:46.588 the investigative reports, 00:50:46.629 --> 00:50:47.630 I couldn't really tell you exactly where 00:50:47.672 --> 00:50:48.840 the bodies were dumped. 00:50:48.882 --> 00:50:50.300 I know from reading the reports 00:50:50.342 --> 00:50:51.760 and from things I've heard, 00:50:51.801 --> 00:50:53.970 there's a piece of jewelry that they says 00:50:54.012 --> 00:50:55.180 that they found at my house up here 00:50:55.221 --> 00:50:57.015 that says matches a piece of jewelry 00:50:57.057 --> 00:50:58.308 belonging to one of the girls. 00:50:58.350 --> 00:51:01.394 - I thought he had seen police reports 00:51:01.436 --> 00:51:02.771 so he knew what to say, 00:51:02.812 --> 00:51:05.231 and he had the motivation to say it. 00:51:05.273 --> 00:51:07.359 - The key witness against Buono is 00:51:07.400 --> 00:51:09.235 his cousin, Kenneth Bianchi. 00:51:09.277 --> 00:51:11.112 His life was spared from the gallows 00:51:11.154 --> 00:51:14.032 in Bellingham, Washington for two murders up there 00:51:14.074 --> 00:51:16.660 in exchange for testimony against Buono 00:51:16.701 --> 00:51:17.869 in the Los Angeles killings. 00:51:17.911 --> 00:51:19.162 - The reality is, 00:51:19.204 --> 00:51:22.374 all plea agreements are, to some extent, coercive. 00:51:22.415 --> 00:51:25.502 You are pleading guilty 00:51:25.543 --> 00:51:27.754 almost entirely in an expectation 00:51:27.796 --> 00:51:30.215 that you will gain something from the plea. 00:51:39.391 --> 00:51:40.767 - The primary motivation 00:51:40.809 --> 00:51:43.228 for Bianchi to testify against Buono was 00:51:43.269 --> 00:51:45.021 Bianchi to save his own life. 00:51:45.063 --> 00:51:49.734 That is an incredibly persuasive reason 00:51:49.776 --> 00:51:52.404 to testify against anybody. 00:51:52.445 --> 00:51:54.823 - It was not a clear-cut case, 00:51:54.864 --> 00:51:56.783 anywhere close to a clear-cut case. 00:51:56.825 --> 00:51:59.619 A big part of it was Bianchi's confession. 00:51:59.661 --> 00:52:01.454 And that was pretty much everything. 00:52:01.496 --> 00:52:04.916 So I felt like Angelo needed to go to trial right away. 00:52:04.958 --> 00:52:06.751 I felt that was our best chance. 00:52:06.793 --> 00:52:08.837 I thought their evidence was weak. 00:52:08.878 --> 00:52:11.840 And I thought Bianchi could be defeated 00:52:11.881 --> 00:52:14.259 in the courtroom relative to his confessions, 00:52:14.300 --> 00:52:17.220 because I didn't think the DA had a case. 00:52:17.262 --> 00:52:20.682 And if they didn't have any other evidence against Angelo, 00:52:20.724 --> 00:52:24.644 that could literally lead to acquittal for Angelo. 00:52:32.819 --> 00:52:39.951 * *